SPEAKER_00 0:00

In Tragedy, a true crime podcast, we discuss missing persons' cases, violent crime, and other sensitive topics that may be difficult for some listeners. Listener discretion is advised. Our show is a place where every story matters and every voice deserves to be heard. To support this podcast, you can subscribe at www.tragedy a true crime podcast.com for early access to new episodes. And join our Facebook community, Tragedy, a True Crime Podcast, for updates, discussions, and ways to support the families we feature. Welcome to Tragedy, a True Crime Podcast. I'm Elisa.

SPEAKER_03 0:46

And I'm Michael.

SPEAKER_00 0:47

Today we're joined by Kathy Lee Sellers, a close friend of Amber's who knew her during her time in Myrtle Beach and remained close to her during the period leading up to her death. As we work to understand not only what happened to Amber, but what her life looked like at the time, Kathy brings an especially important perspective. She knew the people Amber was spending time with, understood her day-to-day life in Myrtle Beach, and can help us explore Amber's relationships, routines, conversations, and anything that may have stood out in the weeks and months before her death. Kathy Lee's perspective gives us an opportunity to fill an important part of Amber's story, the period immediately leading up to her death, and to better understand Amber's life as it was being lived at that time. Kathy Lee, thank you for being here and welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_01 1:42

Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate what you're doing here.

SPEAKER_00 1:46

Thank you. We are happy to have you and thank you for trusting us with your memories of Amber. And we'd like to just start with your friendship. So tell us how you and Amber met, how you became close, and what your friendship with her was like.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

Amber and I met at work. We worked at a sports bar in North Merrill Beach together for years. She was a girl who liked to have fun and liked to do karaoke and just hang out with it. It was a pretty tight-knit group, about 10, 12 of us. And one of our big things that we would do was have themed parties. I had a themed party every year for my birthday for like 10 years. So that was one of the big things we did. We, you know, do an all-girls party or a wig and out party or stuff like that. She was just a fun person. She had uh a remarkable eye for fashion. She was in college for fashion design. So she was the girl who, when she walked in the room, her outfits were just the cutest put-together little outfits. They had a little flair to them, you know. She was just a really sweet girl. We had a lot of fun together. She was a great friend to me. There were numerous times that she would step in and she would do anything for her friends. Um, I got into a situation at one point where I had to leave a boyfriend, you know, that I was dating for uh bad reasons, I guess. And I made a phone call, and within two hours, Amber was at my door ready to pack my stuff. She was that kind of a girl. She was do or die. She was go hard. There was never anything small that she did. She was just a great girl. Now there are some things, you know, that I think she was very uh, I don't want to say gullible, but very trusting. That's a good word to say. She loved everybody and she just, you know, just lived in her own little bubble that she was just happy go lucky. And sometimes she didn't think of dangers that could come with some of her choices. But she was a New Yorker that had no problem with saying what was on her mind. She was very blunt, but also just the sweetest girl you ever met. She was my size. We're both very, very small, and we were about nine years apart. She was kind of like a little sister to me. So I tried to help her and guide her with some of her decisions she made, but she was just the greatest friend ever. She was always there for me. And I even though she was younger than me, we would have talks on the beach about my future and her future and what she should do and what I should do. She gave me lots of great advice. She was a really good girl. I really loved her with all my heart.

SPEAKER_00 4:48

We know from speaking with uh Amber's sister that she did have an affinity for fashion and was going to school for that. I would love for you if you can think back about one of those themed parties and one of her costumes or outfits that was just on point with that theme and and and tell us that story.

SPEAKER_01 5:07

So the very last one that she was there for. It was called the Heaven and Hell party. So her and I were sitting down at work one day, and I was like, okay, my birthday's coming up. So what theme are we gonna do? Because we'd done so many different ones already, like guys and dolls. We've we'd done everything. So she came up with heaven and hell, and I'm like, okay, well, what do we dress as? She is angels or the devil. So she showed up in the cutest little white dress with this little jacket and a little halo. It it was awesome. There's a picture actually of her and I, and we're slow dancing, and she's dipping me. It's the cutest picture. I'll treasure it forever.

SPEAKER_00 5:46

So let's talk about when you learned that she had died, and what is your recollection? Did you get a phone call? Just tell our listeners about how that went for you.

SPEAKER_01 5:58

That's a horrible menu memory. Um, so basically the night before, uh, so Amber had stopped working with me a couple months prior to this night, or the night before she was she was murdered. I hadn't hadn't seen her in about a month, month and a half, maybe. We were I went to the bowling alley after I got off work and I saw her there that night. So, anyways, your question was the night that I found out. So the day that this happened, I was off from work that day and I kind of laid around the house and I was a little hungover because I had two drinks that night. So I laid around the house all day and decided I was gonna go to bed early. So I went, laid in my bed, and I put my phone, I went to put my phone on silent, but I saw 17 missed calls and my heart dropped. We just previously had a manager very young, had a heart issue and pass away. So I knew something was wrong, and all the missed calls were from my work, my boss, and my friend, another friend that worked with us that was very close to Amber. Um so I I called this the restaurant and the hostess answered, and I said, Hey, I have 17 missed calls. What is happening? And you'll never believe what the host said to me. She said, Is this Kathy Lee? I said, Yes. She said, Amber's dead. What do you what do you mean? Like I've talked to her twice today. What do you mean? She was shot in the head and I lost my mind. I hung up and I dubbed 911. I have no clue why I did that. I d I didn't know. I d I didn't know, I didn't accept what I I don't feel like I fully have accepted this still 13 and something years later. So I called 911 and I'm screaming. I'm like, my work just called and they told me Amber's dead, that she was shot in the head. Like, please tell me this isn't true. Please tell me this is wrong. Like, stop, stop, stop. Who is this? So this is Kathy Lee. You know, tell me that this is not true. They said, we need to talk to you right now. I'm like, sure. Where do I need to be? You know, adrenaline kicked in. So they told me to come to the police station. So I did. And it it was crazy. I'm still a little upset. I think I understand now why they said what they said to me, but from someone who's never ever had this anybody around them like this, nothing like this ever happened. I walk up, it's night. It's I was going to bed probably about nine o'clock, so that puts this about 10, 1030. And I walk up, and these man and a woman police officers are outside and they meet me and they look at me. And the first thing they said to me was, You were our number one suspect, and I wanted to fall over and die. Because I did not understand. And they said, Until we see you. I'm like, okay, like what is that even supposed to mean? So now I understand the way the process of crime works is the last person seen, the last person that talked to the victim. You start it there, and then you go out and you start ruling people out. And also, her manner of death, I couldn't have done it. And they they knew that when they saw me. So I don't know if you want me to go into that right now or you want to ask me later. But basically, when they looked at me, they said, You were number one suspect until right now. And basically what they meant by that was they wanted to talk to me to rule me out, but they also knew by looking at me, by how little I was, that there's no way I could have done what was done to her. So that I mean, they asked me a bunch of questions that I didn't know the answers to, you know, or where was she there? And I told her, told them that I'd spoken to her at 12:30 and that I'd received this weird text at 2.32, I think. But I didn't see it until about seven o'clock because I was using laying around the house. And then I text her back, and of course, no response. So that was basically how I found out that she had passed away.

SPEAKER_03 10:32

When you say weird text, what do you mean by weird text? What was weird about it?

SPEAKER_01 10:36

Well, I didn't understand the text. And like I said, I didn't see it when it came in at 232. I wish for everything in this world that I had, because if if I had just seen this text, I would have called her right then and like, what are you talking about? And maybe she could have told me who was in the car, what her plans were right then, what she was doing, because that's the imperative moment when I need to know who was with her. But I didn't, and I didn't see it. So the text it said, and I'm gonna leave names, I'll just say the first letter. It said, Hey, did you hear I was sleeping with D up at overtime? That's all it said. Question mark. So my response when I saw it that night was because remember, I told you I talked to her twice that day. She texted me and I spoke to her at noon because she was at the salon getting her hair done. We had the same hairstylist. So I text her back and I said, D, question mark, huh? What are you talking about, basically? And I said, Send me pictures of your hair because she was supposed to get her hair done the same color as I had that day. So that was the text message. Did you hear I slept with D up at overtime? And she sent the same text to our boss. So I believe that whoever was with her accused her of doing this, and she wanted to know because she didn't work at overtime anywhere. She started working at Greg Norman's. So she called the two people that would know if it was going around overtime.

SPEAKER_00 12:18

It feels like there was an indication, or at least the police believe that you were the last person to see her alive. Is that was that accurate? Or how do you think they had that information?

SPEAKER_01 12:29

Well, through her text, I think that I was with her the night before. And then, like I just said, she called me at noon. So I'm sure that was on her phone. And then she texted me at 2:30. Her body was found, I think, at like 4, 4:15. So literally an hour, hour and 30 minutes after she texted me. So I'm sure when the police got her phone, they said that it was right by her fingertips going off, which I would have been one of those texts. When they talk about it on the news that her phone was blowing up with text, I was one of them.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

Yes, thank you for clearing that up. So not necessarily that you saw her, but could have potentially been her last point of contact.

SPEAKER_01 13:12

Right. Right. Maybe she could have told me something on the first phone call. I know the text, they saw that, and then they saw my response. So I'm sure they knew I'd because I asked the question, what are you talking about? So yeah, more so the text and the phone call that I was spoken to her that day. So maybe I could provide, you know, what she was doing, who she was with. And unfortunately, I mean, I have the timeline because we've done a lot of research and cameras and everything. It's been years of just detective work, you know, internet sleuthing that try to put together this timeline. And it wasn't just me. As you know, there's a lady with the name of G that has put a lot of work into this and has told me things I didn't even know. It was a lot going on, and I think that if I was them, I would have wanted to talk to me too.

SPEAKER_00 14:05

Yeah. That does make perfect sense. It does. Yeah, yeah. It really does. Now the timeline you're talking about, yeah. We talked with um Gina a lot about that. And it is, you know, it is good to have that, let's call it, footprint, right, of what she was doing leading up to her murder, the exchanging of clothes and the convenience store and all these surveillance um camera footage of her. We would like for you to talk a little bit about the months, you know, weeks and days leading up to her murder. And if you noticed anything odd about her behavior, behavior changes, or behavior that maybe she was engaging in that maybe she hadn't before, that we might term as sort of risky behavior.

SPEAKER_01 14:49

Right. And I I will agree with you. There was some risky behavior because of things that happened. So I guess I'll start from the kind of beginning. So she went over to London and she was studying abroad with fashion design, and she met Jose, which was her fiance. She was scheduled to be married, like within two months of her murder. The actually the night before her murder, she was at the bowling alley. It's before I got there. But she was showing everybody her wedding dress fitting. So she met Jose, and when she came back, she told me, she's like, Oh my gosh, I'm in love. I'm gonna marry this man. And I remember thinking to her, because she was like nine years younger than me, my sweetheart, you're gonna marry a guy you met one time in Spain. Are you crazy? Like, I just, you know, I didn't I didn't fall for it, you know what I mean? So I at first I wasn't really supportive of this relationship. Now, after he came to America numerous times and I saw them together and I saw how happy she was, I supported her. Because when if she's happy, then I'm happy. I always had a little thought in my head about Jose that uh I didn't quite trust him. I felt like he had a little bit of arterial motives as far as maybe coming to America, and I think that claim came to be true, but anyways, um so she meets him, everything's going great, he's coming over here, you know, they're up at overtime doing karaoke together and like facetiming every single night. I FaceTime with Jose a couple times with Amber or Skype or whatever it's called on the computer. So the arrangement was she was bringing Jose over here and they were gonna get married. Well, Amber, which is this is not unlike her, she just gets an idea and she just runs, and she doesn't think twice, she doesn't think about the details, like she was just very young, maybe a little naive is a good word. She had a great heart, but she didn't see things that some other people saw. So uh the arrangement was she was bringing him over here, but I don't think she researched how that works, how like I don't know if it's called a K1 visa or whatever it is, but basically, when you do that, you have to have a sponsor, and she didn't make enough money to do that, so she had spoken to her father, and apparently she told me her father agreed to sign. So everything was great, but then at the last second, meaning like two months before, like I'd say a month before her murder, a month and a half, all of a sudden she's all upset and she's crying, and I don't know what I'm gonna do. Like, what's happening? What's wrong? She's like, Well, my dad said he will not sign for him, so I have to move to Spain. And I remember looking at her, say, You are not moving to Spain. Like, nope, we can't do that, Amber. Like, you can't leave me here. I love you. You know, you're my friend. You don't know anything about Spain, are you sure? And she was gung-ho, it was gonna happen, and she was gonna do whatever she had to do to get the money together. She was moving to Spain for the love of her life. Like I said earlier, she had stopped working with me. So I didn't see her every day like I was used to seeing her. So I don't know exactly the things that she was doing, but I know some of the things. So that's kind of I think what started this whole situation and the what you guys claimed risky behavior is when she found out her father would not sponsor Jose to come over here, she just whatever she had to do was what she was gonna do to go over there and marry the love of her life. So I think you know that she she already had risk behavior. That was just who she was. I don't think she she was a great girl. I'm not to say anything about it, God bless you, Hammer, but she didn't think before she did certain things and made really, really bad choices that scared me. I had to have many talks with her about safety and protecting herself and not putting herself in a situation where she could be hurt. I literally looked at her in the face because something she had done, and I said, Amber, you cannot do things like that. It's nighttime. You let someone in your cart, that's how people get murdered. I literally said that to her. And now I feel bad. But that that's the kind of risky decisions she was making.

SPEAKER_03 19:47

What the kind of what other kind of risky behaviors are you referring to? Because it's I feel like you're being a little bit vague here. I want to make sure that we understand it. Was it drugs? Was it something else?

SPEAKER_01 19:56

Um It was all of the above. It was well, we might differ on opinion on the risky behavior when it comes to drugs. And the reason I say that is because like smoking pot or taking a Xanax. Now, I I guess that is risky behavior, but that was a normal thing for uh some of the people in our group. We all smoked. So that, you know, when you you know how they say smoking is a gateway drug. I always thought that, but it actually is, and the reason it is, is because people who sell pot, for example, that's not the only thing they sell. You might not know what else they sell because it that's how dealers, I'll say that, it's how dealers operate. They only let you know what you are doing, you know. Like if they have that, for example, like the person we got smoke from. Now, looking back, I know that person sold a lot more than smoke. I just never knew that because I didn't do that. So they never told me. Dealers always they never use their names, they always keep their past hidden, and they only reveal just what information that you need to know. So I didn't know that the person that I was buying smoke from was selling like white stuff, powder stuff, you know, and probably far beyond that. I just didn't know that because I'd never involved myself in anything like that. So it's the people, people she was around like this guy. Uh it's actually the guy that I was just speaking about that she picked up in the rain. So the night, what is call him E? The night that uh we were sitting at every time, she told me I need to go to the gas station. I need to grab some cigarettes. I'm like, okay. And it's literally 50 feet away. So 30 minutes goes by. And I'm starting to get worried. I almost called her, but she walked in the door. She walks in soaking wet. I'm like, girl, what where what happened? Like, what what is happening? And that's when she picked up that guy in the rain, the E guy name, and they actually became friends. So another example, and this has to do with that guy. So one night we needed to go get some smoke. And apparently this guy also sold it. So we go over to this apartment, and I'd never been there. I'd never met this guy, but I knew Amber for years and years and years. So I trusted, I was I'm a little hesitant on some of her perceptions of people. So I knew to kind of be on guard because she didn't think about things like that. But so we walk in this apartment, and there's this, I hate to call her a stripper, but it's the truth. There's this blonde girl, really pretty blonde girl, and some other guy, and then the E guy. And we're all hanging out, and everybody is very intoxicated that was there, not me and Amber. So we go over there, and that this E guy is straight up hitting on her, which was normal. I mean, guys always hit on her. So Amber did kind of what I do. We just, if we're not interested or it's, you know, not gonna happen, we just make very light of it and kind of laugh it off and just don't hurt anyone's feelings, you know. But the fact that he was hitting on her so blatantly, and this blind girl was his girlfriend. So she was drunk and she kept just looking like she was about to fight Amber. So I'm telling her, like, we need to go, we need to go. And Amber's just in her own little world, just smoking, hanging out, letting this guy hit on her. This girl's literally about to jump her. So I got her out of there, and I get in the car, and I'm like, girl, what was that? Do you understand that girl's about to hit you? Like, did you not see that guy was hitting on you? And she was she was mad that was his girlfriend. She was like, Oh no, it's no big deal. You know, he does it all the time. It didn't mean anything. I was like, Well, it about got you in a fight right now. You need to be careful. And she just blew it off, you know, it's uh no big deal. Like she did everything.

SPEAKER_03 24:26

Well, one one thing I want to go back to a little bit is the story originally started was, you know, around the need for money. And so I'm interested in how does this risky behavior lead to if her motivation was to get money for this move, um, how does this lead to more money for her? It sounds like we just got involved with some unsavior k unsavory characters.

SPEAKER_01 24:47

I would get onto her when she would do things I didn't think were safe. So from what I know now, I did not she didn't tell me any of this when she was doing it. Because she knows I would have flipped out on her if I had known that she'd done some of this stuff. So allegedly, she was doing things and hanging out with people to get money. There's like three stories just off the top of my head that I can think of. Like, even the police asked me, how does she have like all these designer clothes? And so, anyways, there was one guy that claimed that she had slept with him for money. There was another guy that we did verify because he did not want to admit this, but he did, and she slept with him for money. So she was hanging out with older men and sleeping with them to try to save up money to go to the love of her life.

SPEAKER_02 25:52

Was this reported to the police?

SPEAKER_01 25:54

I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_02 25:55

Was this reported to the police?

SPEAKER_01 25:58

Yeah, they know. Okay. I don't know if they know about the the guy, the pill guy. That was someone I don't know who he is because I had a friend that was helping me do this that was a lot stronger than I am mentally, and I was too scared to go to some of these people because they were shady, shady people. For example, one of the men was the exact man that Amber texted me about, that text message we talked about.

SPEAKER_03 26:24

Right.

SPEAKER_01 26:25

One of them was him, the one that starts with a D. And I if they asked me, like, do you think I'm like, there's no way she slept with that old man. There's no way. But our friend cornered him, got him alone, and said, Look, I'll never tell anybody, you know, that this is true, but did you sleep with her? Did this happen? And he admitted it. She did, he did sleep with her for money. So she was I think she was just going around and using her guy friends in any way she could to try to get this money together. And it makes me feel horrible that she did that. It's not a good choice, of course. Um, but that isn't her who she is. It was, I think, acts of desperation. I think that she had it in her head she was in love and she was moving, and she didn't care what she had to do to get that money because she only had two months before the wedding at this point.

SPEAKER_00 27:33

Did she ever speak to you directly about situations in which she felt uncomfortable or threatened or controlled or unsafe? No.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

For that matter, he never felt unsafe. She didn't have that in her, if that makes sense. She didn't have a situational awareness. She was she lived in her own happy, little, safe little bubble to where she didn't notice, like the girl that was about to hit her. She didn't even notice that this girl was about to jump on her. She just wasn't aware. She was so sweet and so naive, I guess, and I mean that in a positive way, that she just did not understand danger and what could potentially happen through her choices. I really think she didn't get it.

SPEAKER_00 28:29

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SPEAKER_03 29:11

Yeah, one of the things we actually had a guest on the show one time, and one of the things that really stuck out to me that he said was the biggest misconception that people have about safety is that it always happens to someone else.

SPEAKER_01 29:26

Right.

SPEAKER_03 29:26

And never happen to her. Yeah, and that's uh I uh this just hearing this story makes me feel sad because it sounds like if all of this is true, I mean a lot of a lot of this is, you know, this is just perception, this is alleged, so we're not presenting any of this as fact um necessarily. But let's even say even part of this is true. There's lots of warning signs there, and it sounds like her what you're referring to as kind of being naive or trusting or gullible, I think was a word that she used, yeah, um, allowed her to feel safe in in reality. It doesn't sound like she was very safe around these people.

SPEAKER_00 30:05

Exactly. If we acknowledge that she was in a a place in her life where she needed to start collecting money, and I also heard you say that I think I heard you say she left the job that you guys um had shared together for quite a while. Can you help me reconcile? Like, why would she leave that job if she was in a place where she needed money?

SPEAKER_01 30:27

Well, she had left that job. This was way before. So sh we hadn't worked together for probably six months. Actually, from what I was told, I didn't even know this. So so for a good like the two months right before she was murdered, I had ran back into her a little bit more. She had moved up to Little River. So I hadn't seen her in probably like three to four months right before those two months right before. So I'd say six months before all this happened, she had, I don't remember if she got fired or if she just quit, but she stopped working with me. And I think for a brief moment, I didn't even know this until after she passed. But someone told me she worked at Tilted Kilt for a brief moment, but then she went to work at Greg Norman's. So the money issue, her leaving overtime, that was six months. Before. Okay. So yeah, so that that's why that money issue had nothing to do with that. But she was at Greg Norman's as a hostess, I believe. She wasn't even a server, but I had actually worked at Greg Norman's before. So I knew a lot of people she worked with. So yeah, that that's I guess the best answer I can give you. She didn't quit right when she needed money. This was six months prior. This was when she still thought that her father, you know, I don't even think she was engaged yet.

SPEAKER_00 31:50

Okay. Thank you for reconciling that for me. I want to ask you this. You know, if you think about the final days and weeks of her life and all the things that you have um shared with us, and we're so grateful that you're sharing all this. Is there something that stands out to you now that you didn't necessarily recognize as important at the time? It's more of like a reflection question.

SPEAKER_01 32:14

Well, there is one thing that happened. It's nothing big, huge, but the more I think about it, I just want to know what was on this bed. So she for a brief couple months lived in this little hotel. It was right beside Overtime and right beside the bowling alley. It was called the Crack Hotel. It's basically where you could rent a room for a week at a time, but everybody that was there was all druggie people, like people strung out on stuff. Her situation, she wasn't strung out on stuff, to my knowledge. Now, if she was doing anything besides smoking or maybe an anxiety pill, then she didn't tell me that because she knows I would have said something to her because I don't I don't agree with that. So she was living at this place, and one night we got off work, and I don't remember, I think this was probably like four or five months before, no, I'd say six months before she was murdered. So one night I went over to her place at the Crack Hotel, and she always would do a Skype with Jose. And sometimes, you know, she'd be like, Here, get on the screen, and I'd talk to him too, and you know, but one day we walk I walked in there and she said, Kathy Lee, I need you to do something. I'm like, What? She said, Whatever you do, do not look at that bed. I'm like, what? And it made me really nervous because I'm thinking in my head, like, what is on the bed? Like, is there a person there? Is there like so I'm not sure. I did I I held my word to her. I just sat down on the couch, and this is like a studio, like one room. So the bed's only 15 feet from where I'm seated. But she asked me not to look, so I didn't, and I always wonder what was on that bed, but I might know the answer. I was told, I didn't know this either, that she did a like a sexy, I think they call it a boudoir something, uh photo shoot. So I think maybe that might be the answer. Maybe the bed had been set up like a boudoir, like I don't know, maybe something kinky. I don't know. But it was weird. It was really weird that she did not want me to look at that bed, but she let me in the apartment. So I guess it couldn't have been something too, too bad, but maybe she just didn't want to have to explain it to me, which it was just a sexy photo shoot for her fiance. I don't understand the problem. But that's one thing trying to is so the question was was there anything that stood out to me? I'm trying to think if there's anything else.

SPEAKER_00 35:00

Yeah, that stands out to you now that n didn't necessarily stand out to you then as you've had years to think back and reflect and I think it was something that does stand out to me is that the whole time I knew her, I knew all of her friends.

SPEAKER_01 35:15

We ran in the same group. But once she stopped working with me, I think she started associating with different people that I don't know or I didn't know about because of all the stories that came out after her murder. There were so many things that were told to me that I'm just like, what? I don't know that person, you know. We were we're all, you know, after she was murdered, trying to figure out who would do this to her. It was a crime of passion. By the way, it was done. They they were mad at her. It was brutal, from what I understand. I've never seen any of the pictures or anything, but I I've gotten descriptions, and I know she had three skull fractures to where she looked like she was shot in the head. But it wasn't a gun, it was a blunt trauma. From come to find out, I just found this out. Someone told me it was a big rock that she was killed with. And this will tie back to the night the police told me I was the number one suspect until they saw me. So the murder weapon is this huge rock, like a 200 and something pound rock that I couldn't have picked up. So back to your question is it was she was hanging out with people that I didn't know, which was weird because we knew everybody in that beach. I'd lived there 14, 15 years. So there was different people she was hanging out with that I didn't know about. I don't know a lot of information about these two in particular, but it was two guys because I started asking about you know, people at Greg Norman's. Did she have any enemies? Did was there any guys that had a thing for her? And I remember one time someone said, Well, there was this guy and this other guy, and they would hang out, but I don't I don't know who they were. Nobody told me a name. And when I tried to find out, like I couldn't get any information. There was also it was this custodian janitor or something where she lived in her apartments in the river that apparently creeped her out and would make her feel uncomfortable. Now she never told me any of this. I found all this out after I think his name started with a R and he had a cousin or something. Well, somebody else figured out their names and looked into them, and they have a very bad rat rap sheet. Now, I was also told the day that she was taken from this earth, the downstairs neighbor heard her walk into her apartment and said, How did you get in here? She screamed, How did you get in here? And then the neighbor did nothing. Nothing. I I mean, I would have ran upstairs if I heard a young lady, a size one, 24-year-old young lady, scream, How did you get in here? I would have run up there, but she didn't, and she said she didn't even call the police till the next day when she saw the police at the apartment, you know, doing crime scene tape. So there's that. So there was a I guess my point is she was hanging out with people that I don't know, and they apparently weren't very good people. I don't know if that ties them into this or not, but it's at least just a bullet point.

SPEAKER_03 38:41

Well, it increases the risk factors, which we talked about before. And um in speaking of that, I want to go back to something, and I I think I know the answer to this question, but I need to ask it anyway.

unknown 38:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 38:51

Is there any possibility that you have any information on she was hanging out with one of these people the same day that she was that she was killed?

SPEAKER_01 39:02

Well, no, I cannot prove anything, but what I can say is I do have a timeline. I actually have it right here in front of me, and we have Amber all day here. Okay, so starting at 1232, when she called me from the nail salon, I have her every movement until 3:15. That's when the neighbor heard, you know, how did you get in here? Or what are you doing here is what I had written down. So we have her, and the way we have this is by surveillance cameras, by street cameras, all these things. So there's 30 minutes or so where she'd made a right, and I can't, let's see what road it was. Um it was before Main Street, kind of around the 21st Avenue. That's not the right road, but right there. That's where she went off the grid for 30 minutes. We can't find any surveillance of her in that 30 minutes of what she was doing and who she was with. But that happens to be exactly where the two people that I feel are prime suspects, the E guy and his friend come to find out oh, oh worked with us. I had known O for 10 years. So actually, this is something that I would I do want to get out there because this is fact and this is something I experienced. And this was terrifying, and this would lead me to believe that if this happened one time, that it could happen again. So when I met the E guy that we've been talking about, I didn't know he and O knew each other. So one night I'm out and I see them together, and I'm with Amber. And I'm like, wait a minute, you're Amber's friend and we work together. How do y'all know each other? And they're like, we've been friends for years. I'm like, oh, okay. So when we lost her on the camera, it's exactly where both of these two guys were. Now, the O guy was air quotes at work, but you have to understand in Myrtle Beach, it's all mom-owned places. So I would not doubt that he could have gone to his boss and said, Hey, because this walking distance, his house where he worked. Everything is literally within like 10 blocks. So it wouldn't shock me that he could have left work and either came back or not came back, but that was his alibi. He was at work clocked in. So let me tell you what happened with this O guy. This was a year before Amber and any of this happened. It was actually one of my other friends, Sarah. We had O was a dealer of greenery smoke. So I had gotten it from O for years and years. And I called him and said, Hey, I need to stop by. And we'd always meet like at a gas station or something. So we did. It was the one right in front of the bar that used to be called Stillwater, like where the Harley Davidson shop is in North Myrtle Beach, right at that gas station. And this guy, who I'd known for eight, nine years at this point, dove into the vehicle and said, Go, go, go, they're trying to kill me, go, go, like a World War II PTSD moment. It was terrifying. He started cussing and screaming and saying they were trying to kill him and go, go, go. And then Sarah, he didn't like her, and he just starts cussing her out. And I am just looking at him like, you gotta calm down. Oh, you gotta calm down. You're okay. There's nobody following you. You're okay. So we we drove him to his house and he jumps out. My point is, so at that point, I have no idea what just happened. I've known this guy for years. He's never, he was actually kind of a sweet guy, not a big framed guy either. He was uh he was a dealer, but he was a light-skinned African-American with dreads, and that is very important because that comes up with the police.

SPEAKER_03 43:24

Yeah, that meets the description of what the boys who found the crime scene, someone walking away with that type of description.

SPEAKER_01 43:31

Yeah, and he's the only one who we knew, period, that matched that description to a T, light-skinned white guy with dreads. That that's oh. So, and the cops came out and asked me that because there was video footage, supposedly, and I'm jump, sorry, I'm jumping around. There's just so much information I have, and the time warner cable where she paid her bill. So let me get back to the the day he for. Freak out. So when he got out of the vehicle, I called my boss, the same boss that got that text message from Amber the day of her murder. We're all very, very close. His name starts with an S. I call S and I'm like, S O just jumped in this car and acted like someone was trying to kill him. Something is wrong. What is going on? And he told me, which I didn't notice. He said, Kathy Lee, he is very, very medicated. If he doesn't take his medicine, he goes completely off the rails. I'm like, wow, okay. Well that makes sense because like he ain't taking his medicine. Because he just got in, cussed Sarah out, and acted like someone was literally chasing him. It was the craziest thing I've ever experienced. So, and it actually happened one other time at work. He was at work, and then I all I know is I don't see him on the he was a line cook. I don't see him on the line anymore. I look back, he's on the floor, crouched, trying to jump under the cabinet. I'm like, what are you doing? He was like, they're gonna get me, they're gonna get me. And I went and got S and they sent him home. So my point about that is this guy normally, pretty I mean, I don't know the morality of the guy because he was a dealer, but nice enough person. You know, we had all hung out before, but if he wasn't medicated, he was not in his body. It is a different person.

SPEAKER_00 45:32

We are aware that there was quite a bit of media coverage related to Amber's death. And I'm just curious, were there any misconceptions that were created or reinforced by the media coverage of her death? And what do you want people to understand about who she really was?

SPEAKER_01 45:48

So the media what you know how when people pass away, all they say is just very blanket statements that she lit up every room, she was a bright shining light, she was this, she was that. That's all it was. It was no facts, it was nothing real, it was all just trying to remember her in a good light. It wasn't anything that would have helped the investigation. It was all just blankets, you know, just stucking, you know, just to look pretty. And I don't believe that's what gets us to the facts and to the answers. So sorry that I jumped around, but there is a something that happened the day that she was killed that is very important. She one of her last stops that she was recorded that day, she went to Time Warner Cable to pay her cable bill. And there was a guy behind her and they interviewed him. And the things that he said were very, very bad. So they said, Okay, there was a girl in front of you. What do you remember about her? And this guy, he was I guess he was a country boy, a good old boy, you know what I mean? Not in a good way, like a racist. So he they asked, What do you remember about this girl? And he said, Well, she was wearing this and she was wearing this, and she had she's driving that SUV out there and it has this sticker and like so many details about her. And he was just standing behind her in line to the fact that the cops were like, How do you remember all this stuff? And I can't say word for word because it is profanity, but he said, 'Cause she had that blank blank N-word black person in her car. So there was a sighting, is the point. The guy behind her in Time Warner Cable saw a light-skinned black guy with dreads in her vehicle. And he was ticked about it. Because he he I guess he was just a racist guy, but he he used a derogatory N-word, you know. So And that's why it may have stood out to him because it offended him. Yeah, that's why he was mad. Because she was a beautiful girl, and I think that he didn't like that there was a white girl with this guy in her vehicle.

SPEAKER_00 48:13

So yeah. And after everything we've talked about today, what do you think is most important for people to understand about Amber?

SPEAKER_01 48:22

People's choices don't necessarily reflect the type of person they are. If you were to look at some of Amber's choices, you'd think that she was very reckless. And she kind of was, but it was all in in her heart. Everything she did was from her heart. She was nothing but love and happiness, and like she just didn't let anything faze her. She didn't, like I told you, pick up on social cues that were negative. She just lived her life and happiness and love like a flower baby. She just did not like nothing phased her. She was a good girl. She had fun. She loved and loved hard. She didn't care what people thought about her. She did what made her happy. She treated her friends really well. She literally saved me numerous times. And all I had to do was pick up a phone and say, I need you right now. And she would be there. She was one of the best friends I've ever had.

SPEAKER_00 49:31

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